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#2011971 - 10/24/12 05:19 AM Re: 10 best 50s rookie cards [Re: gaugman]
33rdStreet
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Frank Robinson has always been under-rated. As a huge Oriole fan I've always just taken advantage and gotten his stuff on the cheap side! One day the hobby may wake up.
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#2011972 - 10/24/12 06:14 AM Re: 10 best 50s rookie cards [Re: gaugman]
bbo
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Frank Robinson also got the stuffing kicked out of him by Eddie Mathews when Robinson came sliding into third base, cleats up. Mathews pummeled him three times to the face before Robinson knew what hit him. Maybe that's why Frank was so moody?

That story was told to me by a former major leaguer who got it directly from Mathews. This particular major leaguer played with Mathews as an Astro in 1967.
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#2011976 - 10/24/12 09:38 AM Re: 10 best 50s rookie cards [Re: bbo]
gaugman
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As I remember the story as it was told to me was, Mathews took exception to a hard slide Robinson made into the bag at 3rd on a close play during a spring training game in 1967. It was one of the last times Mathews would play 3rd before moving across the diamond to settle in at 1st

Mathews fell on top of Robinson as his legs were taken out from under him and the two started jostling. It’s then Mathews smacked Robinson across the face with his glove.

They were separated almost immediately as it took 3 people, the pitcher, the 3rd base coach, and a random fan from the stands, to hold back Robinson from going after Mathews. Rumor has it that Robinson went looking for Mathew's after the game but Mathew's skipped the showers that day and left immediately after last pitch.

Funny part of the story was that some say the fan that day who helped restrain Robinson from doing bodily harm to Mathew's, was the older brother of Annise Parker who is now the mayor of Houston. I personally don’t buy it.

Not meant to be taken seriously. A poor attempt at humor.


Edited by gaugman (10/25/12 04:26 AM)

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#2011979 - 10/24/12 12:14 PM Re: 10 best 50s rookie cards [Re: gaugman]
bbo
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I'll stand by my version, as relayed to me. My source was a backup catcher for the Astros and was telling me some "inside baseball" stories.

It's documented here (take this particular article with a grain of salt considering the author, who wouldn't want you to ever get cheated):
Mathews "pummels" Frank Robinson

Another version:
Robinson's version



As for a fan from the stands entering the field of play, even in an exhibition game in the 1960's, that's highly unlikely. So, I'm with you on that part: I don't buy it either.
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#2011980 - 10/24/12 02:48 PM Re: 10 best 50s rookie cards [Re: bbo]
trex
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It actually occurred in 1960 and it wasn't in a spring training game, it was in the first game of a twi-night double header on August 15th.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=13...pg=7042,2691750

Mike, you've peaked my interest as to who your source is. Here's the 1967 Astros roster:

Pitchers

25,30 Bo Belinsky
47 Wade Blasingame
26 John Buzhardt
44 Danny Coombs
35 Mike Cuellar
49 Larry Dierker
44 Tom Dukes
44 Arnold Earley
36 Dave Eilers
13,31 Turk Farrell
39 Dave Giusti
43 Pat House
48 Barry Latman
33 Jim Owens
36 Claude Raymond
19 Howie Reed
46 Dan Schneider
41 Carroll Sembera
31 Larry Sherry
31 Bruce Von Hoff
23,40 Don Wilson
37 Chris Zachary

Catchers

4,27 Dave Adlesh
7 John Bateman
9 Ron Brand
8 Bill Heath
60 Hal King

Infielders

14 Bob Aspromonte
42 Lee Bales
8 Jackie Brandt
28 Julio Gotay
17 Chuck Harrison
16 Sonny Jackson
15 Bob Lillis
11 Eddie Mathews
18 Joe Morgan
12,19 Doug Rader
11 Bob Watson

Outfielders

22 Ron Davis
20 Jim Landis
21 Norm Miller
20 Ivan Murrell
28 Aaron Pointer
10 Rusty Staub
24 Jimmy Wynn

Other batters

29 Candy Harris
34 José Herrera

Manager

1 Grady Hatton

Coaches

3 Jim Busby
2 Nellie Fox
6 Al Heist
33 Jim Owens

When you said backup catcher I thought maybe Bateman, but he came up through the Houston minor league system and didn't make the bigs until 1963.
The only player I see on the roster that would have been on either the Reds or Braves in 1960 was Mathews. Cuellar was with the Reds in 1960, but I'm pretty sure he was in the minors and not a backup catcher. Buzhardt, Farrell and Owens all pitchers were with the Phillies in 60. Latman was wtih the Pale Hose as was Landis and Nellie, Sherry with the Dodgers, as well as Aspromonte and Lillis. Brandt was with the Orioles. Al Heist was with the Cubs, Busby was with the Red Sox.

Okay, I give, you've got me stumped.

Mathews also got into a fist fight with Jackie Robinson, August 1954, when Jackie came in "spikes high." This came as a result of the Dodgers Clem Labine drilling Milwaukee’s Joe Adcock in the head with a fastball, and the Braves’ Gene Conley retaliating by knocking down Jackie Robinson. Not sure how that brawl turned out.
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#2011981 - 10/24/12 03:31 PM Re: 10 best 50s rookie cards [Re: trex]
trex
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Ah, I think I got it. Johnny Edwards, 1969 roster though. Signed in 1959, Reds, rookie season was 1961, but he just might of had a cup of tea late in 1960 with the parent club around August where he would have seen the brawl first hand.

What say you Mike?
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#2011982 - 10/24/12 03:44 PM Re: 10 best 50s rookie cards [Re: trex]
bbo
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That's pretty good detective work, Columbo. But it's not right.

Mathews told the story to the backup Houston catcher when they played together in 1967 in Houston. When the fight occurred in 1960, the catcher was playing for USC in college.

He also told me John Bateman was a jerk.
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#2011983 - 10/24/12 04:01 PM Re: 10 best 50s rookie cards [Re: bbo]
trex
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Okay, I misunderstood, the story was relayed by Mathews to this mysterious guy in 1967, but he wasn't really there in 1960.

So, backup catcher, played for USC, and on the Astos's roster in 1967...Bill Heath.
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#2011984 - 10/24/12 04:01 PM Re: 10 best 50s rookie cards [Re: bbo]
Mintacular
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Registered: 08/19/09
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First off, I don't think the Wilhelm RC should be on this list....As for Clemente, bringing up his humanitarian bonafides as "overrating" him misses the mark as collectors do not only collect based on pure statistical marks, as these men are more than just number crunchers and represent bigger ideals. Clemente also played on a small market team and meant so much to the city of Pittsburgh and kept the franchise alive and kicking. Also, Clemente was a one of a kind five-tool talent that played with a certain passion that is matched by nobody, or very few. I won't go into the racial aspect but he was a very important piece into bringing Latin players into MLB.
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#2011985 - 10/24/12 04:52 PM Re: 10 best 50s rookie cards [Re: Mintacular]
33rdStreet
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I don't think saying he's a notch below Aaron is a knock on him or means he's over-rated I think his popularity comes from other area's as you mentioned. That card is higher than the Aaron on that list for hobby reasons not baseball reason's. It's a card that's harder to find in higher grades. I've been looking for a centered nm one for years it seems!!
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