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#344247 - 02/18/04 03:22 AM ..
MW1
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#344248 - 02/18/04 09:10 AM Re: Major News from Collectors Universe! [Re: MW1]
shouldabeena10
Learning the Ropes


Registered: 10/24/03
Posts: 48
Loc: Pasadena, Maryland

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The copyright to the SMR is owned by CU, and it is also published by CU. Odyssey still has their logo in the book as Odyssey Publications, but I believe they are probably talking about selling off the "old movie stars" memorabellia auctions that Odyssey holds. I can't imagine CU getting rid of the SMR... you'll probably just see the Odyssey logo removed and replaced by a CU logo in future issues. No biggie.

Also, I'm glad to see that CU is getting away from the auctions and selling business. I've always found that to be somewhat of a conflict of interest with their card grading ventures. Since sometimes the differences between a PSA 8 and a PSA 9 can be almost undetectible .... it's hard to have confidence in PSA 9's that are graded and then sold off through different arms of the the same parent company.

I think the selling of these companies is a good move and will help bolster the confidence in PSA and CU.
_________________________
Football: 1800's-1947 EX+, 1948-55 EX/MT+, 1956-65 NM, 1966-69 NM/MT, 1970-76 NM/MT+, 1977-88 Mint.

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#344249 - 02/18/04 09:20 AM .. [Re: shouldabeena10]
MW1
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#344250 - 02/18/04 10:10 AM Re: Major News from Collectors Universe! [Re: MW1]
buttermarc
Collector


Registered: 07/10/03
Posts: 79
Loc: NYC

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Quote:

Quote:

I think the selling of these companies is a good move and will help bolster the confidence in PSA and CU.



SBA10,

What if no one steps forward to buy the companies that are operating at a financial loss? Does that mean that the perceived conflict of interest will persist and that red ink will continue to blot the ledger?





Well, SMR will probably continue to have some sort of business relationship with CU either way, since they are both essentially promoting the same end product. How that translates to the in-kind and other payments down the road will be interesting.

Superior was purchased by CU a few years ago. At that time, Chris Porter and Greg Bussineau ran the business. I think the owners at that time made out pretty well. I imagine that Chris (who is one of the few guys in the hobby that I have never heard anything negative about....) would like to stay on with Superior in whatever capacity he can. I cannot imagine that Superior, in and of itself, is a money losing enterprise.

If, as you say, "the red ink continues to blot the ledger", I would assume that CU would not keep the business..... (e.g. fire, downsize, however you want to suggest it...)
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#344251 - 02/18/04 12:06 PM Re: Major News from Collectors Universe! [Re: buttermarc]
Basilone
If I just sell the car, I can up my bid...


Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 166

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This seems to be pretty big hobby news.....I posted the info over accross the street.

Any word if this will effect the Spring Auction or future auctions?


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#344252 - 02/18/04 12:17 PM Re: Major News from Collectors Universe! [Re: Basilone]
MW1
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#344253 - 02/18/04 03:45 PM Re: Major News from Collectors Universe! [Re: MW1]
estang
(S)uper Collector


Registered: 11/15/02
Posts: 495

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OK. I admit that I don't follow the auction part of the hobby well enough to understand the impact of this announcment. Help me. Net this out for me.

On the surface it seems like a good business decision. Focus on what you're best at and remove the aspect of what seems like "colusion" type aspects of filling an auction house full of your own product to reap the best possible $$$.

I don't see directly how this decison effects the masses. These auction houses seem to cater to the elite / rich; the 1% of the population. You often hear that 1% of the U.S. population controls 99% of the wealth. I'd be interested to understand how that correlation corresponds to the sports card trading market, not the sports memorabila market. For me, collecting game-used this and that, just doesn't do it for me, nor does hit my budget.

I need to be enlightened here.

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#344254 - 02/18/04 06:53 PM Additional Info... [Re: estang]
botn
I am gonna miss that car.


Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 215
Loc: Santa Monica, CA

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Most of which you can bet Dan "Orlando Jr." Markel (Dude) will deny.

Six more employees were given Pink Slips. Head of Customer Service, Peter Ma, along with three other Customer Service employees and two management level employees.

Being Head of Customer Service seems to be a position in which an employee can count his or her days. CU is a business and must be conscience of costs but they certainly have a knack of letting go of qualified people in order to save a few $$. It is very clear that the cut backs in recent years have harmed PSA in terms of Customer Service and more importantly the quality of the product coming from the grading room—CU’s core business. I understand that GAI, who has already displayed a history of picking up all of the qualified people that CU has let go, will be making an attempt to get Ma.

In addition, Greg Manning Auctions has purchased Superior and supposedly one of the Coin Auction divisions. The reports were that Superior was purchased for between 7 and 14 million, a number which I feel is probably overstated.

Once again, this would not be a complete post unless I again made an attempt to discuss Mr. Joe Orlando. As anticipated, Joe posts on the CU message boards to "address rumors". First off all Joe, these are not rumors. Secondly, the only "rumors" that you have not attempted to address but continue to avoid, are those surrounding the WIWAG cover up. Amazing how quickly Joe will write to tell collectors that he does not actually have hemorrhoids from being Hall's puppet but he will not even mention anything having to do with WIWAG. Makes you wonder since Joe was quoted as saying, “more details would follow at the conclusion of the investigation.” Could it be the investigation is not concluded or is Joe really just a liar?

You have to wonder how much more hoop jumping Orlando must do before he will be getting that vote of confidence from David Hall.

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#344255 - 02/18/04 07:30 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: botn]
aconte
Bid more or post more... tough one...


Registered: 02/22/02
Posts: 1895
Loc: On The Beach....where else!

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Botn,

I read your post. The big question that comes to my mind is this. How many
more ex Psa people can Gai continue to hire? If for example some of the
other graders leave Psa will Gai grab them too? Also, if Joe O were let go
do you think he would get hired by Gai...

aconte
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#344256 - 02/18/04 07:53 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: aconte]
buttermarc
Collector


Registered: 07/10/03
Posts: 79
Loc: NYC

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Quote:

Botn,

I read your post. The big question that comes to my mind is this. How many
more ex Psa people can Gai continue to hire? If for example some of the
other graders leave Psa will Gai grab them too? Also, if Joe O were let go
do you think he would get hired by Gai...

aconte





Question:

How much overhead can GAI actually absorb? They've got some powerhouses there already -- do they have adequate FCF to rationally support more? I like GAI for many reasons, and am putting together my first submission to them. But my experience seems to suggest that they have not gotten the critical mass of dealers and minor collectors buying into their model (yet), which makes me question whether they actually need someone like Peter Ma. I'm just interested in how much cash GAI burns, if any. Just seems like they have a lot of heavyweights there -- and I'm not convinced that there is adequate submissions coming through on a regular basis to support the model long-term. Especially if some of the big-set crossovers have been essentially done at cost or gratis....

MS
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#344257 - 02/18/04 07:57 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: aconte]
MW1
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#344258 - 02/18/04 07:59 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: buttermarc]
MW1
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Quote:

...and I'm not convinced that there is adequate submissions coming through on a regular basis to support the model long-term.



Nor am I.

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#344259 - 02/18/04 08:05 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: MW1]
aconte
Bid more or post more... tough one...


Registered: 02/22/02
Posts: 1895
Loc: On The Beach....where else!

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MW1,

Like that one!

I laughed when I typed it. I'm waiting for Botn to respond.

aconte
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#344260 - 02/18/04 08:06 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: aconte]
aconte
Bid more or post more... tough one...


Registered: 02/22/02
Posts: 1895
Loc: On The Beach....where else!

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MW1,

What's up with the red man's?

aconte
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#344261 - 02/18/04 08:33 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: aconte]
MW1
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#344262 - 02/18/04 08:50 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: botn]
HonusWagner
Hobbyist


Registered: 08/02/02
Posts: 69
Loc: Toronto, Ontario

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BOTN,

You used to be an outspoken opponent of GAI but now you're their #1 supporter....in fact, so much so that you're beginning to sound like Steve Rocchi. Please dispel the rumors that you two are the same person. Thank you.

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#344263 - 02/18/04 09:33 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: aconte]
botn
I am gonna miss that car.


Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 215
Loc: Santa Monica, CA

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Quote:

Botn,

I read your post. The big question that comes to my mind is this. How many
more ex Psa people can Gai continue to hire? If for example some of the
other graders leave Psa will Gai grab them too? Also, if Joe O were let go
do you think he would get hired by Gai...

aconte




Aconte-GAI is doing fine. It would be irresponsible of me to speak on matters concerning their finances but I can assure you that they are doing just fine. They are a two year old company who has continued to exceed their expectations of gross revenue. I am sure that they could use someone like Peter Ma who I have always found to be very hard working and trained by a very qualified person, Charlie Kahler.

As discussed tonight with Baker, when Orlando is let go, GAI has made it clear that there is no room for him in their offices unless he would like to work directly under their janitorial staff. Guess he may have to sit for the BAR after all.

Quote:

and I'm not convinced that there is adequate submissions coming through on a regular basis to support the model long-term. Especially if some of the big-set crossovers have been essentially done at cost or gratis....




MS-You would be surprised how many dealers are endorsing both GAI and SGC in addition to PSA. Collectors are crossing their collections and not all of them are done at cost. As it stands now, GAI has more representation in the April Mastro auction than PSA. I would say that is an endorsement of some sort. As PSA continues to trip over their own two feet, GAI and SGC will be directly benefiting. Dealers and collectors, who never before considered using these services are openly embracing the opportunity.

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#344264 - 02/18/04 09:37 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: HonusWagner]
botn
I am gonna miss that car.


Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 215
Loc: Santa Monica, CA

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Honus

I am flattered in your interest but this was covered recently in one of my posts. If you cannot find it I will send you a copy of my autobiography once it is published.

Best regards,

Greg

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#344265 - 02/19/04 04:30 AM Re: Additional Info... [Re: botn]
Davalillo1
Collector is an understatement.


Registered: 09/10/03
Posts: 119

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I don't know which is more pathetic on the psa boards:

Orlando acknowledging his own company's press release that MW1 brought to everyones attention. And then saying don't worry--the virtually useless SMR will continue in its present form--hooray for the PSA PREZ.

The lapdogs that bow down every time he gets on the board and says absolutely nothing.....at least he cannot insult one of his biggest customers now that I am not there....oh gee Joe thank you for clearing the air about this rumor and speculationand please Joe bend over just a little bit more so I can plant that kiss right on your rear end.

Meanwhile of course, there is only misinformation that comes out and absolutely no answers to the pressing questions of the day...which have been repeated over and over again.

I am glad to hear that there is no job for him at GAI--I as well have noticed a decline in market share of psa among major vintage dealers(mostly at the expense of GAI).

Dav

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#344266 - 02/19/04 05:34 AM Re: Additional Info... [Re: Davalillo1]
aconte
Bid more or post more... tough one...


Registered: 02/22/02
Posts: 1895
Loc: On The Beach....where else!

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MW1,

Your response on the red man's was classic.

aconte
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#344267 - 02/19/04 07:37 AM Re: Additional Info... [Re: aconte]
Basilone
If I just sell the car, I can up my bid...


Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 166

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Did you guys listen to the conference call....some interesting information. They project the sale to finalized sometime in the next 2 quarters. In addition, they are looking towards acquisitions in 2005 with the excess cash (that was from the Q&A session).

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#344268 - 02/19/04 10:50 AM Re: Additional Info... [Re: Basilone]
jackstraw
Talkative?


Registered: 02/23/03
Posts: 744
Loc: @ a Baseball Card Show

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jim,
any update on your cards?
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#344269 - 02/19/04 11:48 AM Re: Additional Info... [Re: jackstraw]
Davalillo1
Collector is an understatement.


Registered: 09/10/03
Posts: 119

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If you mean have I decided to switch them over, I think I said that I was not going to rush into anything despite the way I was treated by the PSA PREZ.

If you mean how am I doing on my sets I just completed the 63 baseball set in 8 and topps super 69 set in psa 9 or better and am 1 card away on 4 more sets to complete 8 or better sets.

Dav

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#344270 - 02/19/04 02:07 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: Davalillo1]
botn
I am gonna miss that car.


Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 215
Loc: Santa Monica, CA

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It is now confirmed that Superior and Bowers were purchased by Greg Manning Auctions. CU's recent sell off is going to result in reducing their number of employees by 60. This implies that further layoffs will be occurring in the PSA division. Wonder who will be getting these plates?


With CU now making their core business authenticating I can now understand their motivation to hide the truth about WIWAG. The existence of a breach in their holders is not something that they would want the public to know about.

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#344271 - 02/19/04 02:27 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: botn]
toothpick
Just got here


Registered: 02/18/04
Posts: 7

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Quote:

Wonder who will be getting these plates?




Your obsession with Mr. Orlando is scary. Try to control your jealousy.

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#344272 - 02/19/04 03:42 PM Re: thanks for the update! [Re: toothpick]
jackstraw
Talkative?


Registered: 02/23/03
Posts: 744
Loc: @ a Baseball Card Show

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Quote:

If you mean how am I doing on my sets I just completed the 63 baseball set in 8 and topps super 69 set in psa 9 or better and am 1 card away on 4 more sets to complete 8 or better sets.





very nice work jim! that 63 set must be a booger in near mint or better and the 69 super is one of my favorites! keep on truckin'.

i was asking if you had decided anything in the way of cross/submission but the update on which sets you have completed is welcomed here also.

john
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Ken Griffey Jr

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#344273 - 02/20/04 08:47 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: MW1]
Lothar52
enthusiast


Registered: 08/23/02
Posts: 240
Loc: Ohio, USA

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hey BMW...here is my 56 topps list for the set...if ya come across any sweet raw that you havent shown me already in these let me know..id also be partial to well centered 80's and up.


90 REDLEGS TEAM NO DATE, NAME CENTERED
178 JOE BLACK redleg
199 HANK THOMPSON giant
223 RANDY JACKSON dodger
231 BOB HALE oriole
302 EDDIE ROBINSON yank

Ryan


_________________________
--------------------
I love CAKE....

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#344274 - 02/21/04 02:00 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: toothpick]
HonusWagner
Hobbyist


Registered: 08/02/02
Posts: 69
Loc: Toronto, Ontario

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Quote:

Quote:

Wonder who will be getting these plates?




Your obsession with Mr. Orlando is scary. Try to control your jealousy.




I second that.

Greg, do you mind telling us where you obtained that image from? Are you stalking Joe or something?

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#344275 - 02/21/04 04:16 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: HonusWagner]
KLL
Hobbyist


Registered: 03/20/03
Posts: 62

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I am sure that this is the work of photoshop or some other software. I can't believe that he actually has a picture of his car. That would be pretty sick and scary.
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#344276 - 02/21/04 04:26 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: HonusWagner]
botn
I am gonna miss that car.


Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 215
Loc: Santa Monica, CA

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Honus, it is you who should know about obsessions as you apparently have one with me. My beef with Joe has only to do with the flagrant lies and total lack of professionalism that he displays on an ongoing basis.

The photo, which was a gift, speaks volumes about David's little pet. I thought it was relevant and therefore shared it. I am far from the only person who has passed judgment publicly as to Orlando's conduct.

Please keep the questions coming.





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#344277 - 02/22/04 11:45 AM Re: Additional Info... [Re: botn]
KLL
Hobbyist


Registered: 03/20/03
Posts: 62

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BOTN

The photo was a gift?

Maybe you really do have inside info on PSA. If you have photos, you may even have tape recordings of the "PSA PREZ" private conversations at work. At home too? This all seems very strange and very scary to me.



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#344278 - 02/22/04 03:29 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: KLL]
botn
I am gonna miss that car.


Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 215
Loc: Santa Monica, CA

Offline
Is it really necessary to pollute the boards with your personal attacks? If you have a problem with me call or e-mail me. I sent you a PM and you did not even have the eggs to reply.

Funny how only the anonymous posters have an issue with a photo of a license plate.

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#344279 - 02/22/04 05:28 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: botn]
HonusWagner
Hobbyist


Registered: 08/02/02
Posts: 69
Loc: Toronto, Ontario

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Quote:

Is it really necessary to pollute the boards with your personal attacks?





Would polluting the board with a personal obsession be preferable?

You know Greg, sometimes I can't figure out whether you and Joe need a boxing ring or your own private room.

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#344280 - 02/22/04 05:39 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: HonusWagner]
botn
I am gonna miss that car.


Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 215
Loc: Santa Monica, CA

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Quote:

You know Greg, sometimes I can't figure out whether you and Joe need a boxing ring or your own private room.




You know Honus, that was actually pretty funny.

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#344281 - 02/22/04 05:51 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: botn]
jackstraw
Talkative?


Registered: 02/23/03
Posts: 744
Loc: @ a Baseball Card Show

Offline
it made me chuckle
_________________________
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#344282 - 02/22/04 10:03 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: jackstraw]
Vintagedeputy
The Collectinator


Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 469
Loc: Richmond, Va.

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I'm leaning towards the private room option.............
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#344283 - 02/22/04 11:14 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: Vintagedeputy]
botn
I am gonna miss that car.


Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 215
Loc: Santa Monica, CA

Offline
Vintagedeputy,

Please leave your personal preferences out of this.

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#344284 - 02/23/04 04:12 AM Re: Additional Info... [Re: botn]
Vintagedeputy
The Collectinator


Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 469
Loc: Richmond, Va.

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Gee, and I thought that this entire thread was about personal preferences.........
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#344285 - 02/23/04 05:32 AM Re: Additional Info... [Re: Vintagedeputy]
botn
I am gonna miss that car.


Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 215
Loc: Santa Monica, CA

Offline
Quote:

Gee, and I thought that this entire thread was about personal preferences.........



No, wrong forum. But let me take this opportunity to congratulate you on your recent nuptial. I certainly hope that Governor Schwarzenegger will eventually support your decision.

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#344286 - 02/23/04 06:49 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: botn]
Vintagedeputy
The Collectinator


Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 469
Loc: Richmond, Va.

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Can I assume that you took my lighthearted comment and turned it into an attempt to call me a homosexual? Is that the best you can do?


Why not step back for a brief moment and look at things from another person's view? Shall we?



I am about as anti-PSA and anyone can be. I've hated the quality of work they perform from day one and I'm sure that numerous SGC employees will tell you that I have touted SGC's abilities for years now. Anyone remember the Graded Card Price guide that had a short history? I had letters in there as well as other hobby publications lauding the efforts of SGC and the quality of work they perform. In my 18 years in the hobby, I've owned exactly one PSA card. A PSA 9 1988 Fleer Update Glossy Mark Grace rookie that was given to me free by a supplies dealers at the Richmond Tuff Stuff Show in 1998. This was because I purchased $20 in supplies from him. Needless to say, that card was moved to an SGC holder in my next submission (SGC 96, believe it or not).


With that being said, let me tell you how a third party views your posts, and please accept these coments as informative not critical. I merely offer them in an attempt to enlighten you as to how others feel, the same way you offer information to enlighten others. Despite the fact that you called me a homosexual in an attempt to offend me, there is no malicious intent on my part.


My view as a collector is that your information and insight in the minute details of the PSA operation are informative and at the same time, overwhelming. As a law enforcement officer, your zealousness in the rapid advancement of PSA's demise is borderline stalking. Whether or not someone's license plate picture was given as a gift is immaterial. The fact that you retain such evidence in your files is a little scary. Your knowledge of PSA's day to day screw up's reminds me of a murder movie where the police find the killer's home and his walls are covered with news stories and photographs of a single individual.


My comment about the thread being "personal preferences" was centered around what makes this hobby great...PSA vs. SGC, Topps vs. Upper Deck, vintage vs. modern, Mickey Mantle vs. Barry Bonds. All too often lately, these boards have become clogged with a banter that I liken to that of a high school debate team discussion on the cold war. Let it go. The greed of modern ballplayers, the overproduction of cards and sets produced and other factors are killing what used to be a fun hobby. All I seek is a return to simpler times.......ya know, collecting baseball cards used to be fun.



Jim
Vintagedeputy


"You may fire when you are ready, Gridley"

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#344287 - 02/25/04 02:26 AM Re: Additional Info... [Re: Vintagedeputy]
botn
I am gonna miss that car.


Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 215
Loc: Santa Monica, CA

Offline
VintageDeputy,

I see that you can dish it out but you cannot take it. I thought that based on your first comment about me that you actually had a sense of humor. I guess it is selective and only at another's expense.

Unlike most people I appreciate criticism. You state With that being said, let me tell you how a third party views your posts, and please accept these coments as informative not critical. I merely offer them in an attempt to enlighten you as to how others feel, the same way you offer information to enlighten others. This thought is confusing as you state "a third party" but then state "others". It is odd because I have received countless e-mails from people who have praised and thanked me for being willing to display the guts to speak out. Not sure that I would continue to provide the information if I knew "others" did not want to hear this information.

I am merely a messenger and you are 100% wrong that I am not interested in PSA's demise. I think that would have a catastrophic impact on the hobby. I am merely trying to effect change that can only occur if the masses are willing to force CU to be accountable. Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

As vocal (I guess you would call it sick, scary, obsessive, etc) as I have been on this message board I have been even more outspoken, in telephone and in person conversations as well as e-mails, with management at PSA/CU. I got nowhere with this method on my own so I have tried to expose all collectors to information that I possess and things that I have experienced.

I have been critical of PSA when they were the only grading company I was using. Steve Rocchi and Mike Baker can attest to that. I was tossed off of CU's message board for voicing my opinion about some cards which I felt were misgraded. At that time PSA was still my primary grading company by a long shot. Once again, I used the message board to raise collector's awareness, which would hopefully have made PSA a better company.

I am not sure that I can relate to the "professional" opinion that you share with a few anonymous posters who feel I am a stalker. If Orlando’s plates had not been the epitome of Vanity Plates, I never would have asked or posted the image. It was nothing more than my trying to goof on a guy who calls himself a President but conducts himself like a 16 year old whose Dad owns the company.

I do not expect everyone to like me, like what I say or even the way I may say it. It is however very clear to me that you render an opinion about me based on knowing very little about me and possibly even less about what goes on and has gone on in this hobby.

I welcome anyone who has an issue with me to pick up the telephone and call me collect. I am always prefer to speak openly to anyone rather than sparing on a chat board.

Greg




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#344288 - 02/25/04 04:25 AM Re: Additional Info... [Re: botn]
vayank
The Amazing Card-Man


Registered: 04/13/02
Posts: 948
Loc: Alexandria, Va

Offline
VintageDeputy/BOTN > Time to go to your neutral corners!!! . You've both had your say, and points have been made... Avoid the temptation for one more response...

_________________________
---- Matthew T. Natale Alexandria, Virginia Completed 1977 Topps Baseball SGC Graded Set, Average Grade 92.89

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#344289 - 02/26/04 03:11 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: vayank]
Vintagedeputy
The Collectinator


Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 469
Loc: Richmond, Va.

Offline
VaYank,

Don't worry. I take no joy in picking a message board fight. I merely wanted to state my opinion. Now that I have done that, I consider this discussion closed in my mind and hopefully BOTN does as well. I still welcome his information and will read every post with interest.

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#344290 - 02/26/04 03:53 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: Vintagedeputy]
botn
I am gonna miss that car.


Registered: 06/18/03
Posts: 215
Loc: Santa Monica, CA

Offline
Agreed. We both have had our say and hopefully understand where each other is coming from. I consider it closed as well.

If he ever wants to discuss anything with me I welcome him to call me rather than hasing it out here. I feel it will be far more constructive for both of us.

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#344291 - 02/26/04 07:12 PM Re: Additional Info... [Re: botn]
Vintagedeputy
The Collectinator


Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 469
Loc: Richmond, Va.

Offline
botn - Thank you for the invitation to call. The same goes for you as well. I don't mind discussing the merits of our fine hobby with another collector at all.

Jim

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