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#417076 - 04/23/04 08:38 AM Network 54 and BOTN
KLL
Hobbyist


Registered: 03/20/03
Posts: 62

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I've just visited the Network 54 board and was very disappointed with what I saw. I always felt that BOTN was nothing but trouble and this only proves it. He has been very negative and I felt his only purpose on this board was to vent regarding his feelings toward CU and Joe Orlando.

I hope SGC's new management takes a peek over there and makes some judgements regarding BOTN. I don't think that we need dealers like that with SGC.
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#417077 - 04/23/04 09:44 AM Re: Network 54 and BOTN [Re: KLL]
srs1a
Old, dense-headed hammers are cool. Best nail pounders.


Registered: 08/15/02
Posts: 987
Loc: NY

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Here's the thread....

Network54 Brawl

It seems that a couple of folks have too much time on their hands and decided to type all night. Neither one comes off looking too good IMHO. Who looks worse? I think it is a toss-up.
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#417078 - 04/23/04 12:00 PM Re: Network 54 and BOTN [Re: KLL]
Davalillo1
Collector is an understatement.


Registered: 09/10/03
Posts: 119

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I too was very disappointed. So disappointed that I did not read most of it.

I had admired certain stands that Greg had taken and I thought Michael was a smart guy. I also thought each had the best interests of the hobby at heart.

I am not sure if I feel that way now. At some point I will try to read the whole thread but in the meantime I am pretty down on the whole hobby.

Jim
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#417079 - 04/23/04 01:49 PM Re: Network 54 and BOTN [Re: Davalillo1]
Basilone
If I just sell the car, I can up my bid...


Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 166

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One heck of battle with 2 message board legends going after one another. I have a feeling that it started out as each other busting each others balls in good fun..but it turned ugly fast.
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#417080 - 04/23/04 01:58 PM Re: Network 54 and BOTN [Re: Basilone]
njdolphins
The Collectinator


Registered: 05/30/03
Posts: 333
Loc: Trimmed, Pressed, Power Erased

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John

You are most likely correct. At the heart of it all though was the insinuation that all grading companies are crooked in some way. VERY disheartening.
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#417081 - 04/23/04 02:26 PM Re: Network 54 and BOTN [Re: njdolphins]
aconte
Bid more or post more... tough one...


Registered: 02/22/02
Posts: 1865
Loc: On The Beach....where else!

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Quote:

You are most likely correct. At the heart of it all though was the insinuation that all grading companies are crooked in some way. VERY disheartening



NJ,

I disagree. I think the heart of it all is that this hobby grows on the basis
of greed and that the lack of knowledge and increased ability of some to
manipulate the graded card market has grown. Meanwhile resources to
combat this type of fraud has been reduced due to profit margins and
EBIT targets. It's unfortunate. But the conversation between the two
can be seen as a representation of what goes on in the hobby. I trust
almost no dealers even before last night's post. Yet I still love the hobby
for the good things it can represent. I collect red man cards and have bought
many from a long time collector who purchased these back in the early
80's. For me I just love what the cards represent. If I look at the hobby
as a whole I find a multitude of problems. Sgc still represents the best
option for MY collection. This will not change for me.

aconte
_________________________
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#417082 - 04/23/04 03:04 PM Re: Network 54 and BOTN [Re: aconte]
KLL
Hobbyist


Registered: 03/20/03
Posts: 62

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One of my CU buddies emailed me some of the more relevant points made by BOTN and MW. I was quick in reading the Network 54 thread and did not really comprehend all that was written by both of them. It appears that MW has stated that he has sent out cards for restoration (for knowledge). I hope this is not true. If this is true, I will be even more disappointed. I hope MW responds and clarifies this for me (us).

What has happened here between BOTN and MW is one reason that no high profile PSA/SMR advertisers vintage dealers post on the CU boards (Drent, Craig R, SSS, Levi...).

If what I am reading is true regarding MW- I've got to think that SGC would have to reconsider its relationship with him too. I hope he post and posts something soon!
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#417083 - 04/23/04 03:30 PM Re: Network 54 and BOTN [Re: KLL]
vayank
The Amazing Card-Man


Registered: 04/13/02
Posts: 948
Loc: Alexandria, Va

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While the thread is amusing, it isn't a commentary on anything but the participants. On the plus side, it's good to see passions among SGC high profile dealers.
_________________________
---- Matthew T. Natale Alexandria, Virginia Completed 1977 Topps Baseball SGC Graded Set, Average Grade 92.89

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#417084 - 04/23/04 03:52 PM Re: Network 54 and BOTN [Re: Davalillo1]
toothpick2
Learning the Ropes


Registered: 03/09/04
Posts: 23

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davallilo you come across as arrogant but deep down i think you are an ok guy who cares about the hobby. i think your big mistake involves poor judgment of character in regards to zardoz. believing that zardoz was a stand up guy you took his word that botn is a stand up guy. funny thing is that zardoz would also say that cramer is a stand up guy. that alone should tell you something.

davalillo what would you think if i were to tell you that the three aforementioned people allegedly engaged in artificially inflating the price of a psa 10 mantle rub off at john branca's expense? would you believe me? i'm pretty sure mike wentz and john basilone could comment on this but i doubt basilone will have the balls to speak up.

mw is a good guy. i can't say the same about botn.
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#417085 - 04/23/04 04:13 PM ... [Re: KLL]
MW1
veteran


Registered: 07/30/02
Posts: 1358

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